Thursday, January 31, 2013
"Broken" English
Reread Amy Tan's writing on the term "broken English." How do you respond to her concern or discomfort? Is "broken English" a fair/accurate/offensive term? Is there some internalized judgement or bias or commentary that allows for the perpetuation of language-based discrimination? Or is it just a term?
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Amy Tan spoke of "broken" English in the sense that it was not correct grammatically, and that people who spoke English would be able to tell that you were not speaking correctly. It seems an almost offensive term and I don't think that it is completely correct to use. Broken implies that something was working, but is not longer. For someone learning to speak English,this is not the case because they, of course have not been speaking it all their life. Therefore, I would not call it "broken" English, but rather "building" English or something of that nature.
ReplyDelete"Building" English still implies improvement, or the need for improvement. Do we agree that, whatever English Tan's mother speaks, it needs improvement? Could her English be legitimate - correct and whole - as it is or no?
DeleteI think broken could also mqean" lacking parts". Wouldn't that fit pretty well?
DeleteYes, there is not doub that there are improvements to be made with the mother's speaking of English. However I still believe that "broken" refers not only to lacking, but more generally as something that was working for a while. "Building" would refer to a language that is constantly improving. It would still be lacking in some aspects, but that it part of learning a language.
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DeleteIn my opinion, "broken" English would mean that someone spoke English for some time, then forgot some aspects of it or simply got lazy. Such as people using abbreviations when talking on social media.
DeleteHere english can't be legitimate. If you concentrate you still could understand her, but it is just messed up. If everybody's linguistic mistakes would be considered as legitimate, whatwould be left of good literature?
DeleteI think that building is the best substitution for the word broken however I feel that broken best describes the state that the language is in at that moment. Yes the language is being built, but like in the broken vase example, the vase will be broken until that very last piece is put into place.
DeleteI agree with you in that her language should not be considered legitimate. You make a good point that you must keep I touch with the rules of the English language, because otherwise everyone would have their own way of speaking. Either way, her language is not legitimate and whether "building", or "broken" it needs improveent to truly fit into an English speaking society.
DeleteI agree with what Rob said because using another language in a native speaking level can sometime be very difficult especially when people already have a mother language. People are more likely to adapt the new language in the old-speaking system. That is why Amy's mother speaks in a confusing way.
DeleteI feel that the term broken English can be offensive if looked at in the wrong light, however it does make sense. If someone is speaking in broken English its harder to understand just like if a vase is broken it's hard to see the original shape. So in terms of that its an okay example. When its used in a derogatory manner it can be really rude because it's implying that the speaker has something wrong with them nt just the language.
ReplyDeleteI imagine that "broken" English will often be harder to understand, like your example of a broken vase. Is broken English acceptable as long as it is understandable? For example, when her mother says, "Why he don't send me check, already two weeks late. So mad he lie to me, losing me money," we do not really need Tan's translation. We know what she means. The purpose of her translating for her mother on the phone is for something other than understanding...
DeleteI like the vase :) we could connect that to roberts idea, that tans mother has a " building" language. Like a not yet finished vase.
DeleteIt is prooven that older people have a lot more difficulties in learning a language. The authors mother is probably not a rarity and I can completely understand that her daughter feels ashamed because people might not take her seriously.
ReplyDeleteBut fact is, her mother speaks english only poorly. "Broken" english sounds hard but I think it's just the truth. Different than chicano spanish, which was just a dialect of the "normal" spanish, this women speaks in gramatically completely confused sentences. Of course her daughter lives her and doesn't want her to feel bad about her limited english, but I think it is weird that she kind of talks of her moms english as almost an own language.
I completely agree with Hannah here. I think Tan is just calling attention to the so-called harsh implications of using the term broken english because she feels bad for her mither. But the truth is that her mom cannot speak in complete sentences, so Tan should try to accept this rather than sympathize so much.
DeleteWhat if the dialect of Chicano Spanish also started out as "broken Spanish?" At what point does a broken version of a language come to be considered a legitimate dialect?
DeleteWell chicano spanish developed because of the influence of the english language. But all the changes due to this influence are still correct, for example the word " chequear" which is an anglizism of the english word " to check". It is used and conjugated just like a regular spanish verb!
DeleteI don't understand her discomfort with the term "broken english". Her mother clearly cannot express her thoughts precisely in the english language. So because her sentences are not complete whatsoever "broken english" is an appropriate term. Tan finds discomfort because she thinks that the term "broken" also pertains to her mothers thoughts, ideas etc, but the term broken is simply just applied to her language and how she expresses these ideas. Maybe the term "broken" is a little harsh, but overall I really don't see anything wring with it.
ReplyDeleteI believe that Amy hates the term because to her, her mothers English is fine and she completely understands what she is saying.
DeleteOkay yes she wants to defend her mother, but don't you think she is being too sympathetic??
DeleteThough it may sound a bit offensive to some people, I believe that the term "broken" is the most accurate of a word there is to describe it. I completely agree when she says how she has spent a long time looking for a word that would better describe it, but there is none. I don't think there is any bias in this statement, I think that broken English is a word that has been used for a long time and it hasn't changed because of the fact that it is simply the most accurate word in this context.
ReplyDeleteI do not think the word "broken" is a good word to describe the kind of English that Amy's mother speaks because her mother is able to express her own ideas completely in English. However, it lacks a well-organized English sentence structure. The word "broken" to me, it refers to a meaning of illiteracy.Apparently,Amy's mother is literate since she can do well in reading and listening. So the word "broken" is kind of offensive.
ReplyDeleteI don't think it matters if she can read/listen. The term solely correlates to the fact that she cannot speak full english. Yes the term may be a little harsh, but it is only the truth.
DeleteAmy hates the term broken English. She believes that is has the connotation of it "needs fixing". And to her her mothers English is fine and perfectly understandable so it doesn't need fixing.
ReplyDeleteI think "broken language" is an offensive term. Once a person's language is described as broken, he/she might be labeled by others that he/she is somehow disabled. For example, in the last Model United Nations Conference, there was a girl representing Philippine. She was not a native English speaker, but she spoke a lot during the conference, and some information she provided was very important and valuable. However, her English skills were horrible, as she used a lot of run-on sentences, or used nouns to replace verbs. Because of her fractured English, many people came to ignore her and pretended not hearing what she was saying. It was not only embarrassing, but also unfair that the girl was being isolated just because she spoke broken English. To be honest, although her English was broken, people can still get what her main idea was if they listened carefully. But the impatience of others were very offensive and make me sympathize that girl. Although these people didn't say to the girl directly, their behaviors were telling the girl like, you are not in our group, because your English is broken, and nobody can understand you.
ReplyDeleteAs far as I am concerned, broken language is just a term that draw people's attention to the fact that there are groups of people who speak not standard english and they live hard lives for sometimes others do not take them seriously enough. It is fair to say that the author's mom speaks broken english. People trend to speak a language as standard as possible, but there are cases that Someone is too old to learn the language or his or her first language has too many influence on their second language. Those are the facts that could not be avoided but still crucial enough.
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